"Am I playing some of my best hockey? I hope not," Datsyuk said. "I think I'm playing somewhere in...

"Am I playing some of my best hockey? I hope not," Datsyuk said. "I think I'm playing somewhere in the middle. I hope to have more energy in my game. I have another level as I get older and get more experience. I can be better and I will."

Tim Wharnsby at CBC - Give the whole thing a read. Wharnsby, like many before him seems to struggle with explaining why Datsyuk is so good while staying complimentary, but the other players in the league are at no loss for words when it comes to talking about his skill and humility.

4 months ago J.J. from Kansas 24 comments 0 recs |

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Hmmm, another writer who thinks Z was on the 2002 Cup team.

Fan of the Detroit Tigers, Lions and Red Wings.

by Elfuego51 on Jan 28, 2012 10:48 AM CST reply actions

Fffuuuu

I came to post that

by timr92 on Jan 28, 2012 11:27 AM CST up reply actions

People also have a big problem with the fact that Wharnsby said Pavel Datsyuk lacks Sidney Crosby’s determination.

I didn’t want to let a little thing like an author get in the way of a good Datsyuk quote though.

by J.J. from Kansas on Jan 28, 2012 11:30 AM CST up reply actions

Or Ovechkin's physicality, apparently.

Goes back to the whole general misconseption that “physicality” = “hit everything in sight”.

by tehGOALIE on Jan 28, 2012 12:06 PM CST up reply actions

I think about the only comparison worth mentioning in that list is the Stamkos one—at least insofar as Datsyuk doesn’t act as an artillery piece for the Wings. Though I imagine he could net some serious goals if he was unleashed and wanted to.

Crosby is known for his determination, but anyone who’s regularly watched Datsyuk wouldn’t be so quick to brush aside his levels of it. Oh well. I guess Wharnsby had to get that in there—something to do with his status as a North American (is he Canadian? Don’t want to assume.)

As for the Ovechkin one, dead on, teh.

by Matt Saler on Jan 28, 2012 12:13 PM CST up reply actions

Tying off that point to the discussion about physicality

it’s a bit hard to define.

I have no doubt that in a physical battle with Ovechkin, Datsyuk would actually win. If there are non-Wings fans scoffing at that, I’d welcome them to look at the way Datsyuk has treated both Zdeno Chara and Shea Weber this season. Datsyuk doesn’t receive or deliver contact as well as the bigger guys, but he’s such a good skater and he’s so well-balanced that he makes it so hard to actually deliver a solid check on him. The same can be said for when he delivers a hit. He’s not going to be as punishing shoulder-to-shoulder, but he can use leverage to knock you on your ass.

However, if you want to define physicality as the tendency to use contact more often, then there’s absolutely no question that Datsyuk lacks Ovechkin’s physicality the same way he seems to lack Stamkos’ “Goal-scoring touch”.

As far as I know, Wharnsby is Canadian. Regardless, he wrote this post for CBC.Ca, so it’s definitely to a Canadian audience. I’m not really as bothered by the whole “doesn’t have the determination of Crosby” thing. It’s flowery crap, but when he decided to go with the compliment for Datsyuk that he is surprisingly complete (which is exactly what he is… because you really don’t expect a guy like Datsyuk to have the entire package as well as he does), he has to go with the idea that it’s easy to overlook him because there are other stars who have things on him. Therefore you go with Stamkos’ scoring touch and Ovechkin’s side. Let’s be honest, if you’re writing this for CBC.ca, you HAVE to mention Crosby; it’s just about government-obligated by this point. What are you going to say about what Crosby has over Pavel? You’ve already used goal-scoring, the arguments for passing or puck-handling can be made, but they’re also kind of weak considering that Crosby is exceedingly strong on the puck, but lacks the purely wondrous dangle that Pavs possesses. Instead, you go with some dumb intangible like “Crosby is more determined” as a bit of a stand in for saying “Crosby is more of a winner” (which is the thought I think Wharnsby was going for, but stopped short of saying because actually saying that would be insulting to Datsyuk and ruin the entire point of the comparisons he’s doing).

Remember, Wharnsby is complimenting Datsyuk by admitting that what he does well (everything) is hard to pin down. That’s why I don’t particularly mind a throwaway comment about Crosby being more “determined”, even though I disagree with that thought taken completely out of its context.

by J.J. from Kansas on Jan 28, 2012 12:51 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs

Therefore you go with Stamkos’ scoring touch and Ovechkin’s side

Typo. Should read ’Ovechkin’s size’

by J.J. from Kansas on Jan 28, 2012 12:52 PM CST up reply actions

This quote hit me too....

How about Crosby’s shot, Stamkos’ speed, or Ovechkin’s physical game? I feel like I wouldn’t too offended by any of those; after all, ‘determination’ is kind of a stupid thing to compare, and ‘goal-scoring touch’, while equally vague, is something I have a hard time giving to anyone over Pavel.

And, yes, Pavel’s physical game may be more graceful than Ovechkin’s, but you can’t just disregard Ovechkin’s size as a huge reason he’s such a dominant player. In fact, it’s probably the main thing that separates him from Pavel.

http://redwingsthoughts.tumblr.com
@wingsthoughts

by RedWingsThoughts on Jan 28, 2012 5:25 PM CST up reply actions

Stamkos may be fast.

but Pavel is extremely under rated in that department. He can turn into a rocket when on the break.

by Kjell on Jan 28, 2012 6:28 PM CST up reply actions

Liking what Chara has to say about Pavel..

“He really makes you think, ‘Wow, that was special’ even when he is doing his normal movements,” Chara said. “To me, he is the best player in the league.”

A pretty “tall” (pun intended) compliment made there by him. Chara also had a few other good points to add, including this one.

Chara doesn’t know why Datsyuk doesn’t receive as much attention as Sidney Crosby or Alex Ovechkin or even Evgeni Malkin, but he has a theory.

“Humble people like him, are very quiet, and they let their actions speak for them,” Chara said. “I think everyone knows he is a great player,” Chara said. “But maybe the other players do more for the game in terms of rivalries or ratings. But we all know he is right there with him.”

Very true. Here is the full article, from USA Today.

"WINGnut--BOLThead"
Let's GO..Wings, Tigers, Lions, Wolverines (oh my!) & Bolts!!!! (RIP Cory Smoot aka Flattus Maximus of GWAR)

by Let's JOE WINGS-BOLTS on Jan 29, 2012 10:37 AM CST up reply actions

I love this quote

“When you win one Cup or any awards you get so hungry you want to win every year,” he said. “But when you miss a year not winning you get more hungry. You want to do better. You think it’s yours and you try to get it back again.” {emphasis added}

by tehGOALIE on Jan 28, 2012 12:08 PM CST reply actions

Datsyuk is like that Ace Pilot that sits idly in a bar.

Doesn’t look like much compared to his more boisterous brethren. No fancy scarf, polished boots, or a million grin. Talks pleasantly with his comrades and other patrons. Doesn’t make a scene. Then next you know he’s at the airfield strapping into his bird. Pulls down his goggles, starts his engine, and takes off to do what he does best. Dazzle and baffle his opponents.

by Idle Drifter on Jan 28, 2012 12:16 PM CST reply actions 4 recs

Perfect

by J.J. from Kansas on Jan 28, 2012 12:39 PM CST up reply actions

Haha. What a great picture that paints, can see him now. Maybe Josh could put something together, to bring it to life.

"WINGnut--BOLThead"
Let's GO..Wings, Tigers, Lions, Wolverines (oh my!) & Bolts!!!! (RIP Cory Smoot aka Flattus Maximus of GWAR)

by Let's JOE WINGS-BOLTS on Jan 29, 2012 10:39 AM CST up reply actions

Sad to say, but...

I feel like if Datsyuk were Canadian and Crosby were Russian, the “determination” point might be reversed. What a load of bs.

by FullMarks55 on Jan 28, 2012 12:36 PM CST reply actions

Crosby's determination is more obvious...

Because there have been stories about how hard he works since he was barely more than a fetus. With Datsyuk, his habits were formed out of the North American eye when he was playing in Russia, so there isn’t a long narrative of how hard he works.

Also, his game is similar to Lidstrom’s in that it has an element of subtlety and elegance that isn’t immediately obvious. You have to watch them both a bit to really appreciate that a great play isn’t an isolated incident, but standard operating procedure for each of them.

Random nonsense at @Baroque97

"It is a mistake to try to look too far ahead. The chain of destiny can only be grasped one link at a time." --Sir Winston Churchill (1874 – 1965)

by Baroque on Jan 28, 2012 1:50 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs

i think you also have to look at the roll the two teams put them in and the system they play

if the pens were as complete as the wings were back in 08/09 then maybe this would be different… but i think the fact that the pens seemed to lean it all on crosby back then just made it seem like he was so determined. when really everyone in canada was determined for him lol. If pavel was on a team from the start that wanted him to go out there and play like ovechkin did in his first few years, all offense all the time, he would have 120 point seasons left and right

by Drumbum87 on Jan 28, 2012 2:05 PM CST up reply actions

Exactly.

"WINGnut--BOLThead"
Let's GO..Wings, Tigers, Lions, Wolverines (oh my!) & Bolts!!!! (RIP Cory Smoot aka Flattus Maximus of GWAR)

by Let's JOE WINGS-BOLTS on Jan 29, 2012 10:06 AM CST up reply actions

I know #87 is a top player but imho he is overrated.

Now this comment might lead people to believe I’m ludicous, however if you were to look at it objectively it screams accurate. I understand that crosby is a better offensive player.

However what people fail to realize is that Datsyuk is a better complete player. While Datsyuk may never get over 100+ points a season he gives 110% effort at all time in every zone of our beloved game. Look at this for an example : I have lived in pittsburgh for around 6 years before moving to Detroit, I still keep in contact with a number of crosby/pens fanboys. Whenever you mention defensive ability and skill they will always bring up the one time last year crosby played goalie for the one time he blocked a goal due to flower being out of position. Know ask any knowledgeable wings fan about datsyuk’s defense. I can’t even count the # of times he makes tremendious plays to stop rushes, and kill prolonged offensive pressure in his zone. You would be very hard pressed to actually come up with a specific example for datsyuk’s defensive abilities due to us being used to the typical 2-4 plays a game where he turns the opponents around. We have become plainly accustomed to seeing this. The same can’t be said for #87.

Datsyuk does what he does to win and keep on winning. #87 while being a offensive phenom can’t really be considered for more than a one zone player. While he does play in more than one zone (he isn’t like #8 on the capitals) he does not make it a priority to ever put consistant effort in all 3. If I was to pick a franchise player for a fantasy draft ignoring the injury issues and making Datsyuk around 8 years younger to make the comparison even every single time I would pick Datsyuk and not even think twice.

If their aren't enough people crazy in this world it would be woefully boring.

Ericcson will be a stable #4-5 in the depth chart by his NEW contracts end. And when looking what the cap will be in three years his contract will be affordable.

by dwkrueger on Jan 28, 2012 6:06 PM CST reply actions

Off-Topic

But check out this article by Nicholas Cotsonika at Yahoo about Jimmy Howard and the recent history of Ken Holland’s player-development strategies. It’s a really good read.

by voline on Jan 28, 2012 7:05 PM CST reply actions

Datsyuk and Ovechkin

Look Datsyuk is my favorite hockey player of all time. But when Ovechkin has that ganas cranked up he plays with a physical abandon, a heedlessness of any obstacle on the ice, like I have never seen in any other player. He’s a force of nature, or was in previous years.

by voline on Jan 28, 2012 7:28 PM CST reply actions

Really, anyone could go out there and just hit everything on the ice. What separates Ovie from the rest (or at least it was until recently) is his ability to do it almost the whole game and not get worn out. If you’ve ever played the game.. you know that just the act of throwing a check can take a lot out of you. Ovie’s ability to do it all game, night in and night out, makes a difference. Add to that the fact he is rarely out of position (another risk of throwing endless checks) and can score.

The definition of a complete player is a tough one. As it depends on what the team requires out of him at any given time. Pavel, Sindy and Ovechkin are complete players in different ways and at different times. The real measurement is how much a player at the end of the day, can benefit their team. After all, that’s what it’s all about.

Especially nowadays, most players who have the biggest and most effective hits are much smaller in size than years past. Example: Kronwall.

"WINGnut--BOLThead"
Let's GO..Wings, Tigers, Lions, Wolverines (oh my!) & Bolts!!!! (RIP Cory Smoot aka Flattus Maximus of GWAR)

by Let's JOE WINGS-BOLTS on Jan 29, 2012 10:04 AM CST up reply actions

What separates Datsyuk

One thing you can’t help but notice when it comes to Pavel, is his stats. Mainly his takeaways stats, then related to the amount of penalty minutes he gets doing it.

For example:

Having led the NHL in 2007–08 with a plus-minus of 41 and 144 takeaways (58 more than Mike Modano second-best total of 86), Datsyuk was awarded the Frank J. Selke Trophy as the league’s best defensive forward. With just 20 penalty minutes, he was also awarded the Lady Byng Trophy

In short, dude is a god damn ninja. Sure their are some discrepancies, as takeaways are a somewhat new stat and it may vary from arena to arena. Still, even if these stats were only slightly accurate, pretty damn impressive. His insane ability to pick your pocket, do it clean and then score. Not just a few good seasons either, Pavel has put up like numbers pretty much every season. And the best part… he just keeps getting better!

"WINGnut--BOLThead"
Let's GO..Wings, Tigers, Lions, Wolverines (oh my!) & Bolts!!!! (RIP Cory Smoot aka Flattus Maximus of GWAR)

by Let's JOE WINGS-BOLTS on Jan 29, 2012 10:27 AM CST reply actions